Base Size

[Larkin Vain]

Will base size matter for the skirmish game? The models that are of concern to me are Ramos and Hamelin. The base they come with seem too larger for them.

[goblyn13]

The bases on those two are larger because, Ramos is expected to have one of his mecha Archnid on it as well and Hamelin will have his dog sitting loyally by his side.

[Malebolgia]

Good point. I don't have it covered yet in the rules but I think it is safe to say that all miniatures should be based on 30mm bases, except for the big golems and monsters like Kolljoy which are mounted on 50mm bases.
Basing miniatures on bigger bases is allowed for the game (gives both advantages and disadvantages), but basing them on smaller bases is not.

[Angel_of_Menoth]

You can use larger bases? Awesome. Any word if Taelor is going to be allowed in the game? I'd love to use the Taelor I did for the last Femme Fatale (on 40 or 50mm base, don't remember and I'm at work). The drawbacks to the larger base might not offset the advantages enough for me, though. We'll see. I'm eagerly awaiting this one.

[EricJ]

So far there is no plans on removing Taelor from the game :)

[Larkin Vain]

Thanks for the info. Don't think I can base Hamelin on a small base with his dog and all. I guess it doesn't matter though as I already based Hamelin and Ramos last night.

I'm guessing a large base makes you a bigger target and also allows more models to engage you.

[Larkin Vain]

Oh which leads me to another question... the steampunk spiders... will the always be on a large base and in groups of 3 or should I put them each on a small base?

[Malebolgia]

3 on a 40mm base as one complete swarm.

[Larkin Vain]

40 or 50? Mine's came with a 50 mm base

[Malebolgia]

Really? I think my 6 swarms came with 6 40mm bases (yes, I do have 19 spiders including the one that came with Ramos ;)). Wait...I'll check the shop.

*Back*
The shop says they come with 40mm bases.

[matty1001]

Mine came with 30mm base's! 3 spiders with 3 bases!

And I too got loads of them lol, I think Iv got about 25!

[Duende]

I thought base sizes didn't matter but how you use them that counts... ?

;)

[Frustrated Father]

There is the possibility that the 40's and 50's got mixed up at one time, particularly early on when my family was helping with the packaging and/or during the three weeks we ran out of 40mm bases. That being said, they are supposed to be on 40mm bases.

Matty, I have a hard time believing we sent 30mm bases for each spider, mainly as for the longest time I had a hard time keeping them in stock but had plenty of 40's and 50's. Sure they didn't just get jumbled in whatever box they are kept in? If not, my apologies.

[matty1001]

Seriously, every packet of spiders (Each set of 3 was in a little baggie) I got had 3 30mm base's in (I'v just measured them aswell to be sure)
I'm not fussed though so don't worry about it.

EDIT: I ordered them after a massive restock, you had just stocked another 200 and sent a mail out. I ordered them pretty instantly, so It was probably just a little mix up.

[Larkin Vain]

Ah I just checked the online store and my rat dude is supposed to be on a 40 mm base.... hahah i have to re-base him now.

So Ramos is supposed to be on a 50 mm base then? Hmmmm sort of inconsistent. I hope game play isn't effected much.

[Frustrated Father]

Keep in mind, the mins came before the game. We're working on that and will be making changes to that, and what is in our stock here shortly. Matter of fact, after this thread, I just moved it up the priority list.

[Larkin Vain]

Great news. I think I'll hold off on painting those models and work on the 30mm ones :)

[Angel_of_Menoth]

So good to hear that everything (or close to it) will be making it into the game. Yes! Loved the models before. Loved the idea of a skirmish game with 5-8 models on a side. Loved the brief teasers I got out of Nathan at Gen Con. Now I've got to decide what I'm going to do about basing the models. Unified, or individual settings...

[Thryth]

Curious. What type of base(s) is Rasputina - The Ice Witch supposed to have? Mine was packaged with a 40mm base, but the on-line store says two 30mm bases. I will probably put her and her familiar on one base in any case.

Thanks

[Frustrated Father]

Another one of those 'working it out'. Partial to the 40mm due to her and the familiar. Its been debated over the two 30mm. Figuring that out right now.

[Hinton]

Well, if the familiar can attack independently of Rasputina, then wouldn't it need to be on its own base? Or will it just stay by her all the time?

[Larkin Vain]

Another one of those 'working it out'. Partial to the 40mm due to her and the familiar. Its been debated over the two 30mm. Figuring that out right now.

Awe man I wish I new this ahead of time. I just finished basing them :( I'm not sure I can re-base them if needed without breaking them :(

[Xenon_Wulf]

Small annoying attacks if it's on a different base, extra attacks for Rasputina if it's on the same base?

[matty1001]

You could do different rules for different base sizes.
So:
Both on seperate 30mm bases:
Rasputina gets 1 attack.
Familiar gets 2 attacks.
Both can attack independantly and recieve no +/- modifiers.

Both on a 40mm base:
Rasputina gets 1 attack.
Familiar gets 1 attack.
But as they are both working together the hit modifier gets +1 or something.

I know that ain't flawless, but it's an idea.

[Vytis]

I say because Rasputina is a mad cool ice chick she gets infinite attacks, simply because she's a CHICK, and chicks rule. Her familiar is an extension.

OK, so thats not the case. I think that the familiar should be on a separate base, and almost a separate entity that gives her line of sight for spells and such. Both being magical entities, they would not get more than 1 physical attack since thats not their gig. Perhaps if the familiar is on the base it could give a boost to spell power or some such bonus.

[Larkin Vain]

As much as it pains me to re-base, I'd rather have a unified rule for her and other model's with familiars.

[matty1001]

I say because Rasputina is a mad cool ice chick she gets infinite attacks, simply because she's a CHICK, and chicks rule. Her familiar is an extension.

OK, so thats not the case. I think that the familiar should be on a separate base, and almost a separate entity that gives her line of sight for spells and such. Both being magical entities, they would not get more than 1 physical attack since thats not their gig. Perhaps if the familiar is on the base it could give a boost to spell power or some such bonus.

Well it as more of an idea with pretty vague examples.

But ofcouse both would have to be equally balanced then the player could decide on the base size they wanted.
So seperately they could have be better at physical fighting, but together better with magic.

Then you are creating a choice for the player, which they can use depending on thier style of play. Kind of like GW's army list, where different things can have different items etc..

But then ofcourse you could use one size of base and have different options for fighting styles.

[Vytis]

Well it as more of an idea with pretty vague examples.

But ofcouse both would have to be equally balanced then the player could decide on the base size they wanted.
So seperately they could have be better at physical fighting, but together better with magic.

Then you are creating a choice for the player, which they can use depending on thier style of play. Kind of like GW's army list, where different things can have different items etc..

But then ofcourse you could use one size of base and have different options for fighting styles.

Right, I see. One player wants to summon and destroy with frozen icy death (and penguins, of course) and the bases go that way, or for similar points and different base set up dispenses the same icy death but with frozen implements of desctruction (and, again, penguins). Offer up options for each type of player, which will increase playability and tihngs. Groovy!

[goblyn13]

you can offer the familiars as an option, where the model can be played with out familiar, with familiar on base, or familiar one separate base. Each having their own advantages and disadvantages.

For example:

Hamelin's dog on his base allows him to have greater control over his kids, while on its own base, the dog can make its attacks, and help to herd the kids.


Or Rasputina, can have her familiar on her base to make her spells stornger, or she can have the familiar separate to have it help to target spells further away.

[matty1001]

Yea, thats what I was on about.

It will increase tactics and encourage different playstyles.

But the trick is balancing it all out so one style doesn't have a slight edge over a different one.

[Malebolgia]

Gamewise it is the best things to keep all human-sized models on 30mm bases and big guys on bigger bases (50mm for most guys that have been designed or will be released).

I will write the chapter about base size this week, so it will be covered :) Other stuff I will work on:
*Implement the list of changes and suggestions Nathan supplied in the rules (which are 20 pages long at the moment...doesn't say a lot at this stage but you can see we have quite some material already).
*Continue with the first stats, abilities and spells for the two first factions that will be worked on. In addition I will think about implementing faction specific stuff and faction buffs and debuffs.
*Work on the rules for Soulstones
*Tease you guys even more ;)

[goblyn13]

:vb_devil::whip:

[Larkin Vain]

Any new updates on base size? Ramos and Hamelin is eagerly waiting to get paint on themselves.

[Frustrated Father]

Cause I know that Larkin has been waiting on Rasputina in particular. She and her little critter are going to be on 30mm bases.

Ramos and his critters, 30mm bases.

Still out on Hamelin.

[Larkin Vain]

Yay! Thanks so very much. I can start working on these guys :)

[DeafNala]

Hey Y'All,
Well, I thought I'd put my two cents in on this one. My experience in gaming is almost exclusively as a "historical" gamer. Base sizes in most "historical " games is critical due to two factors: 1- each figure represents more than one "man";i.e, one mini might represent 10, 20, or more [or less] actual men; the rules will dicatate a specific ratio;e.g. Vietmeyer's Column, Line, & Square rules used a 1:20 ratio. 2- there is a determined ground scale;e.g., 1" = 10 yards or some such nonsense. Ergo, the size of the base reflects the area that 20 actual men would occupy in a certain formation, usually a line.

Since skirmish style games seem to be of a 1:1 ratio, the area occupied by the mini supplies its own ground scale, so the size of the base becomes rather irrelevant. To my admittedly feeble old mind it would seem a lot easier to mere state the number of opponents that could be squeezed in on a particular sized creature; for example; 4 human size opponents, or two lage opponents could combine against a single human size creature [this is actually a bit more than could fit, but gamers Do try for every ounce of advantage]. The base is really just there to keep the mini erect & provide a means of handling the piece without damaging the lovingly applied paint job, & should be more a matter of taste or lack therof.

Being the fine group of folks you all seem to be, I'm sure there are no rules lawyers to be found anyway.

The Familiar Question: if you have a little critter based with his/her larger friend & said critter can move off on its own, you might use a marker, coin or somesuch thingy to mark its position [more than one marker, one of which is the actual position marker, could be used, if it could sneak about or remain concealed]. When detached the mini could sport a ring, rubber band, etc. to denote its absence from its owner/buddy/employer.

[WEiRD sKeTCH]

Cause I know that Larkin has been waiting on Rasputina in particular. She and her little critter are going to be on 30mm bases.

Ramos and his critters, 30mm bases.

Still out on Hamelin.

Longtime lurker, finally posting. :ciao:

So, Ramos & each Steampunk Spider thing are going to be on the 30MM bases now? I just want to clarify since the store still lists them with 50 & 40's.

Thanks in advance!

:theyareon

[St. Anger]

Longtime lurker, finally posting. :ciao:

So, Ramos & each Steampunk Spider thing are going to be on the 30MM bases now? I just want to clarify since the store still lists them with 50 & 40's.

Thanks in advance!

:theyareon

I would like to know, as well. Thanks

[Frustrated Father]

Welcome to Wyrd.

Eric, your ball.

See, that's delegation folks ...

[TheBugKing]

Welcome to Wyrd.

Eric, your ball.

See, that's delegation folks ...

Also known as:

Ducking the Bullet
Passing the Buck
Hiding behind your title

<grin>

[EricJ]

aka showing his ignorance? :D

Base sizes. Most Masters will be on either 30mm or 40mm and generally will be your option, which means you can base Ramos and Rasputina on either one based on your modeling desires. While the difference in size will have MINOR logistical differences in game terms, they aren't enough to make any meaningful difference in game play.

Spiders are spider swarms, not individual spiders, and should be mounted on 40mm or 50mm bases.

Hope that helps, happy to answer any other questions!

[demonherald]

so what about the single familiars.. I think that was the main question...
Ya know like The little doggy of rasputina and is the spider with ramos purely a bit of extra scenery or can it act idependently??

[goblyn13]

and how about Hamelin and his buddies.

[EricJ]

sorry, sorry, familiars.

Yes, they will be able to move independently of their master in some instances, so you have 2 options. Base it separately, while attached to the master it will need to be kept touching the masters base, but can then move. Alternatively, build it into the base of the master and have a placeholder for the familiar. This later instance will be required for some masters who have attached familiars (like Nicodem), unless you make a seperate Vulture mini from the graveyard sprue :)

As for Hamlin, he is like Nicodem, with an attached familiar, although you can of course model him unattached.

In all cases, individual familiars should be on 30mm bases. Masters can still be on 30mm or 40mm regardless of if their familiar is modeled onto their base with them

[demonherald]

sorry, sorry, familiars.

Yes, they will be able to move independently of their master in some instances, so you have 2 options. Base it separately, while attached to the master it will need to be kept touching the masters base, but can then move. Alternatively, build it into the base of the master and have a placeholder for the familiar. This later instance will be required for some masters who have attached familiars (like Nicodem), unless you make a seperate Vulture mini from the graveyard sprue :)



hmmm I sense a nifty little basing article ..the cogs are turning......

[EricJ]

hmmm I sense a nifty little basing article ..the cogs are turning......

ooh, that can't be a bad thing :D